Carol:
Hey there, Rebels. Welcome back to another episode of the podcast. I'm excited about today's conversation because we're going to talk about technology and AI. We have, honestly, one of the thought leaders in the career space here today, particularly in the future of work, to share all that she knows about this particular new wave that we're finding in how people are not only finding positions, but also utilizing it and how it's really changing the landscape of work.
Let me start by just introducing who we have here. So today we have Marie Zimenoff. And as the CEO of Resume Writing Academy and Career Thought Leaders, she merges vision and best practice training to elevate the careers' industry worldwide. Since 2008, she's trained career professionals around the globe in resume writing, career coaching, and business development, and as I mentioned, is one of the leading thought leaders in the future of work. And today what we're going to talk about is AI, ChatGPT, and how it has and how it will possibly impact where we're going in terms of the landscape and future of work. And so with that, I would love to welcome you. Thanks for being here, Marie.
Marie:
No, thanks for having me, Carol. I'm so excited to talk about what people can expect in the future.
Carol:
Yes, I love that. Marie and I know each other because through Career Thought Leaders, not only am I a member of it, I'm also on one of the councils that we have. Marie and I have got to know each other, I've participated in a lot of trainings that they have available, got certified in so many other things that I utilize that you guys heard me talk about on the podcast and what I used to help my clients. So I have full faith and confidence in anything that Marie shares because she definitely, as I said, is a leader in the space. I will just start off by just, generally, what is ChatGPT? When people talk about AI, what are some of the things that they're referring to in terms of AI-enabled and generated-AI services and platforms?
Marie:
Yeah, it's interesting. Most recently I've heard people saying that ChatGPT isn't really AI, which is artificial intelligence, but that it's augmented intelligence.
Carol:
Interesting.
Marie:
I find that interesting where... Yeah. In some ways I think it's people trying to take it down a notch because it isn't... In their right AI, artificial intelligence, is pattern matching, it's neural linguistic processing, it's machine learning. It's a computer learning how to function like a human would. It's a computer learning how to display some kind of intelligence. There's a lot of pieces that go into that, and we'll talk about some of those as we get into how it's used in hiring. But the ChatGPT is really a place where we can ask questions and ChatGPT will go out and find data. It's a huge data processor, and it will then put that data together and generate text. That's kind of the G part, is that generative, where it's generating new text. It's not copying and pasting from the web, it's generating new text to answer our question.
You've probably seen a lot of stuff online where people are talking about prompts, and a prompt is a way that you ask ChatGPT a question. And when you ask a question, again, ChatGPT goes out, it accesses its data pool if you're using the older version that doesn't go out to the web. Or if you're using the newer version or Bing search or Google's Bard, then it's going out to the actual live internet gathering data and generating an answer back to your question. And so it's this new way of searching. It's a new way of gathering data. It's a new way of compiling and analyzing a lot of data really quickly to answer your question.
Carol:
That's really fascinating because I haven't heard it called augmented, but that makes a lot of sense. I love the distinction that you're talking about, that it's not just looking for data that's already out there, but actually generating new information or new text based on your prompt or your query that you put in there for ChatGPT. In terms of how it's used for job opportunities or job search process, how are people leveraging ChatGPT in that way?
Marie:
Yeah, I see a lot of it out there and people saying, "Oh, ChatGPT can write your resume," and it absolutely can. But it can't write your resume, it can write a resume.
Carol:
Great distinction.
Marie:
Great. When you ask it to write a resume, it will write a resume. It will go and pull from... I mean you think about the books and samples and all the things that are available online, it's going to go and pull from that information, analyze the data, and present a resume back to you that's using that information it can find online. And so it can write a resume. Why I say it can't write your resume is because it can't tell your stories, it can't write your bullet points. It can give you ideas. It can give you a model. It can give you a template to start with. And it can tell you if you've got the right content in your resume. So those are some great ways to do that and to analyze. It's great at analyzing. It's great at generating ideas. It does generate text, but you want to be a little bit careful there because the text that it generates is always going to be generic. It's not going to be something that you would want to put out there without quite a bit of editing.
Well, so one of the ways I love to use it, because it's a data gatherer and a brainstormer, it's a great brainstormer, I love to use it to help people think about ideas. If I know that I love to use these skills, I could go in and I could say, "List 10 careers that use these skills," and that's going to help me brainstorm. I'm less loving it when I've seen some people say, "Ask it for an ideal job description." One, that one idea doesn't give us much to go off of and it's very rarely going to be spot on. You can ask it to do that, but it's probably going to be less helpful than if you asked it to generate 5, 10 ideas for you.
If you're using the version that goes out live to the internet, you could ask it to do research, you could ask it to do labor market research, you could ask it to do company research. Again, making sure that you're using either the newest version. I like to use Bing search for those because it's free and accessing the internet. So you can do a lot of research, idea generation, some analysis, but be careful with it generating text. Although I do see people say to use it for editing, when you're talking about editing your resume, I'd be careful with that because, again, when it edits, it's not just going to edit, it's going to bring in that generic language that it thinks is the best because that's what it sees out there the most. So I put in some resumes and said, "Edit this," and what it does is remove some of the specifics in place of generics. And so, I'm not keen on using it for editing. I would more likely use a technology that's specific for editing like Grammarly instead of using ChatGPT.
Carol:
Okay. I want to back up a little bit because you've mentioned several other platforms, Bing and Google Bard and the new version or the other versions of ChatGPT. Could you just quickly give a little bit of rundown of what are some of these different platforms and what's the difference between the versions of ChatGPT and what people should look for, just for people who are complete novices in this world?
Marie:
So OpenAI is the company that launched ChatGPT. It had been, from what I understand, in development for a while, and Microsoft launched that. Microsoft purchased the company that had started it and then launched ChatGPT. I'll say ChatGPT-3, although technically it's ChatGPT-3.5. That's the first version they launched, and it's free. If you go to OpenAI, and you can open an account. It's free, but it's limited, just like any other kind of freemium service where it's free for a while and then [inaudible 00:09:35]-
Carol:
Like that word. Did you say freemium? I like freemium. That's such a good word.
Marie:
Well, that's a very common business model in the software world where you can try this software for free for this amount or this little part of it. So that was ChatGPT-3. Then ChatGPT-4 launched, and ChatGPT-4 is 20 ducks, 20 ducks... 20 bucks a month, and it goes out to the internet. So ChatGPT-3 just had its own kind of insular data set that the programmers had used to build it for goes out to the internet then. But again, still Microsoft based, OpenAI, same company, just the newer version and the paid version versus the free version. But a lot of people that I see talking about things on the internet, I'm like, "Ooh, Bing would be a much better place for that." So here's a very cool thing, if you go to Internet Explorer, which... Or Edge, sorry, Internet Edge, which we'd all forgotten existed. I mean most of us use Chrome or Safari or something. But Edge is going to make a comeback now because if you go to Edge and you go to Bing search, you'll see that on that Bing search page this little prompt comes up and it says, "Do you want to use chat-based search?" So now you can get the same kind of features you are getting in ChatGPT but using a Bing search. Very much like a Google search, but it's right there in Bing.
What I love about that is that when you're trying to do research, when you do it in Bing search, it not only gives you an answer like ChatGPT does, it's a little slower and it's not it's an article that you could take out and use it as an article like ChatGPT will write you.
Carol:
Gotcha.
Marie:
Yeah, it's a little less good in the writing, but it will link the specific resources it's pulling from at the bottom, so the data points. Now, they still might be junk, right? You still want to go to that site, see if it's the right data, see if it's good data. But now you can do that in just a few clicks because Bing not only gives you the answer to your question, but it gives you the sources that it pulled its data from right underneath its answer, which I love.
Carol:
Yeah.
Marie:
Now, Bard was Google's answer to ChatGPT. I don't have access to Bard, but what I've heard from people that do is that it's just not as good. The tech behind it, the writing et cetera, was just not as good. [inaudible 00:12:25]-
Carol:
Okay. And when you say Bard, you're saying B-A-R-D?
Marie:
B-A-R-D.
Carol:
Gotcha. Gotcha. Okay.
Marie:
And now that ChatGPT is out there and the code behind it is out there and the ability to use the code, from what I understand, Microsoft made that pretty easy and pretty cheap, so you're seeing a ton, like something new every day that is using the tech behind ChatGPT to power its own thing because they made it really easy to buy into the software and use it as the backend to whatever it is you want to do. So the writing systems that had been available before like Jasper, Jasper was a tool for marketers that had been around for, I don't know, a year and a half or two years before that, now Jasper could buy into ChatGPT text, and boom, all of a sudden now Jasper is better. So it's just interesting to see how a lot of these systems that already existed and were trying to achieve the same thing that ChatGPT did, now they can tap into ChatGPT's tech and overnight they're a thousand percent better than they were the day before because they're using this tech. And there's some job search systems and some career coaching systems that had been in development for years that now they can tap into this technology and they're going to be better very quickly and probably available to the public really quickly.
Carol:
Wow, that is fascinating, I mean, so many changes and developments. I heard you mention earlier that you could use it to write resumes, cover letters, to edit your resume so I'm assuming you can cut and paste your resume and say, "Improve upon it," or "Give me some bullet points or rewrite these bullet points that maybe sound better." Or something else you said about if you want to have ideas about skill sets or things of that nature or what jobs may actually fit the kind of skillsets you have, which really, that's a great way to use it as a research tool. But I think one time I heard you speak about this, because you did say be careful that sometimes they spit out information that's not accurate. If you're just saying, write my resume, it'll throw information that may not be true.
I think I did this as a test with a client of mine. I think she used it to write a cover letter and send it back to me. And it gave her all this data or gave her stats that she did this and she did that and she was impressed by what ChatGPT spit out for her. But I'm like, "It's not really correct. It's just guessing and embellishing what could look really good in a cover letter." So how would you suggest people really be careful with utilizing the tool when they're thinking about using it in the job search process?
Marie:
Yeah, so again, I wouldn't ask it to necessarily generate text that you are going to use in your resume or cover letter. If you feed it text, you can ask it to write it better. You could send it your resume and say, "Write a cover letter from this resume." So you've got to give it the right inputs to get the output that you want, otherwise, you're right, it will go out and it will grab a great sounding bullet point from someone else's resume online and throw that into your document, but that's not yours.
It can be a great model and you could say, "Okay, these are the types of accomplishments I want in my document," but then you're going to have to write your own content. Then you could use ChatGPT to make it better or to make it crisper or whatever it might be. And so you can use it. I know some people are less purist than me. I really believe that our resumes and our cover letters need to speak to who we are and speak to our stories and that if you're using generic statements, one, you just aren't going to stand out. And two, it could bite you. You could use this statement that you can't back up in an interview and now you're in trouble. So the process that I would suggest people use is that you write your stories out, maybe long form, right? You don't have to worry about is it the right format, is it the right way to write it? I could write my challenge action results story, put that into ChatGPT and ask it to generate resume bullet points based on these stories. I've done that where I've put in some kind of story language and say, "Turn this into a LinkedIn About section," and it does.
Carol:
Nice.
Marie:
It can be my voice, but only if I give it my content to use when it's writing. Otherwise, it's going to use someone else's content to write and that's not going to be very helpful for me.
Carol:
Yeah, I like that. I like that. What about the interview process, how could it be useful in the interview process?
Marie:
Yeah, so thinking about the preparation piece, you could ask, "What are the common questions in this field?" The more specific you get, the better it will be. So if I asked, "What are the most common questions for a DEI executive in this industry?" is it going to be right or not? I don't know, but it can give me a place to start. I would never want to use it as a sole data point. Got to use your brain, use your research, talk to people, and then you can use ChatGPT too. And then you could ask it to generate answers to those questions. Again, warning, caution, [inaudible 00:18:40]-
Carol:
Yes, red light, beep, beep.
Marie:
But you could get some sample answers and see what it says. And then again, think about how you might structure your questions. You could put in your answers. So you can write out or even audio your answers and transcribe them, put them into ChatGPT and ask, "Am I hitting the main skillsets?" Or "Improve this answer for me." Here's where we get to the fact that ChatGPT is a general tool and there are specific tools that might be more powerful for some tasks. When you get to writing, so let's say I want to write a Facebook ad if I'm a marketer, I'd actually be better off using Jasper or Writesonic or some of the free things that people have created using ChatGPT to do that.
But it's a system that's trained in the formula. There's a formula for Facebook Ads, there's a formula for these things. And so, if I use a system that has the formula already, I'm going to get a better answer. I can get it out of ChatGPT, but it's not going to be targeted to that formula. I would say that in interviewing, there are a lot of systems out there that are trained in giving you feedback more specific to interviewing or more specific to communication that would be a better use of technology. So ChatGPT, it's going to be generic, it's going to be general. It doesn't have that specific training on interviewing skills or-
Carol:
Gotcha.
Marie:
... communication skills, so I would go and use one of the systems that is specific to interviewing or communication skills. I know Yoodli, Y-O-O-L-D-I. Yooldi, is that how you spell that? I think so.
Carol:
Yeah.
Marie:
I mean it's Y-O-O-D-L-I, Yoodli. They do communications, and so their system would give you feedback on your communication skills. There's a bunch of interviewing ones out there that will give you feedback on if you're hitting the right interview competencies. I like, it's called VideoBIO Recruiter. They started out making video bios and now they do recruiting, but their system, it's trained to give you feedback on what recruiters are looking for in interview answers. So if there's a specific tool for what you're doing, I would check out that specific tool instead of-
Carol:
Gotcha.
Marie:
... using ChatGPT, just to get better feedback than generic feedback.
Carol:
Yeah. Wow, there are so many great AI powered tools out there that can really help you, and so you're getting some really good insight on some of the ones that you can actually utilize more effectively in one area or the other. So thank you for sharing those. Now, what about if you're transitioning, right? You've been in a career for a long time and you are trying to map your skills against maybe moving into something else or even seeing what could potentially maybe even be available to you or some ideas if you just wanted to do some idea generating in your career, how can you use ChatGPT for that? Or is there a different type of AI tool that would be better suited to support that process?
Marie:
Yeah, I think that ChatGPT could be a good place for the brainstorming piece, like as you were saying before, where you can put in, "These are the skills I like to use." You can put in a job description. The more content you give ChatGPT, sometimes the better, and sometimes it has more room for error. So if I give it a whole job description and I say, "What types of jobs would someone be good for if this is a job that they've done, for instance?" and I put in my existing job description, it'd be interesting to see where it would go with that because you're giving it a lot of information.
I like to take it in steps, so I would first say, "What are the main key skills used in this job?" And then I'd say, "What other jobs you use those key skills?" When I'm working with people in career transition, I'm sure you do this too, I like to identify what they like to do, not necessarily just what they've done. So I'll go through and figure out what do they like to do from that job or other jobs, and then put that into ChatGPT, "What jobs use these skills?" and put in the skills that they know they like to use. ChatGPT will list out 10 jobs that use those skills in five seconds. It's amazing.
Carol:
Yeah.
Marie:
And then you could ask it, I've tried this a little bit, "What are the common skills between this job and that job?" and it will tell you. It's going to be generic, maybe a little fluffy, but it's a place to start. You could ask it, "What skills might I be missing if I've done this job and now I want to do that job?" Give it job descriptions, give it skills, and see what you get from it.
Carol:
Yeah. Yeah.
Marie:
You can ask it, "What are the qualifications required for this job?" And especially if you're using four, which goes out to the internet, is going to look at new job descriptions, but even three that's looking at data from 2021 and before, depending on what type of job you're looking at, that probably would be good enough. You can see what are the requirements for this job, what are the qualifications that I might need? And it will tell you. If you're using the newer systems or even Google... oh, not Google, but Bing searched, you could ask it for labor market information on those things you're considering. You could ask it for the general salary research on those jobs that you're seeing. And I would use Bing for that so that I could click through to the links it's referencing when it's giving me that information.
Carol:
I would think similarly, if you were looking not only to transition, but maybe to go after a promotion or go after some jobs, the same concept to be able to utilize the search in those way. And that's very robust and very thorough in terms of what it can give you back. But to your point, and I just want to iterate this too, that don't let that be your only thing you look at. If it does spit out 10 jobs, don't think, "That's it. That's all I could do. It's the 10 jobs ChatGPT gave me." To echo your point earlier, I just want to reiterate that it's a research tool, it's a starting place, it's part of a larger, broader support or resource that you may want to utilize alongside coaching and other support to really get you where you want to go. I mean, wouldn't you say that?
Marie:
Oh, yeah. Well, and this is one of the things in the career space, people are saying, "Oh, is it going to take our jobs?" I was like, "Well, if people could decide on what career they wanted from a list of 10 options, they wouldn't have used a career coach 10 years ago." You could get this information before it just wasn't as easy. It's the same information, it's just easier to get. But if you could choose your career because ChatGPT gives you a list of 10 careers, you didn't need a coach anyways, right?
Carol:
Yeah.
Marie:
And so what you're saying is that we get this list of 10, we are still going to have to research it. We're going to have to decide what's the best fit for us. We're going to have to see themes and take that and adjust it because, as you've said, the tenant gives us one that's not our whole options. And two, it's very unlikely any one of those 10 is going to be a perfect fit. But now we've got this idea and this goal that we can go on a journey to figure out what's the best. Your coach is your guide on that journey of what is the best fit, what theme is pointing us in the right direction. And so, more power to you. If you're DIYing it out there and you're getting those 10 recommendations from ChatGPT, and you're going to researching it yourself and figuring it out, that's great. If you want a coach, that's what coaches are there for, is to be your guide on that journey and to help you unravel all of that information to make it fit for you and help you decide what's really going to be the best fit for you.
Carol:
As we look at the future of work, how has ChatGPT really impacted really the landscape of work? I mean, I understand there's positions that have been either created or you see on the news all the time that some positions may be in jeopardy because of it? What are you seeing in terms of the forecasting, in terms of the impact of ChatGPT on the future of work?
Marie:
Yeah, it's so hard to tell. It's so interesting. So I just gave a presentation last week for the Colorado Career Development Association, and we were looking at the data from the World Economic Forum 2020 report, which obviously was before ChatGPT. But they were talking about how some of the routine jobs that you do over and over again were going to go away. Even before ChatGPT came on the market, we were talking about automation removing some jobs. One of jobs that they were talking about, a main category, is manufacturing. But the person that talked right before I talked at this conference was from the community college and talking about how they've had to have a huge ramp up in their manufacturing programs because the manufacturers in this area can't find talent.
And so, here you are looking at this jobs report saying that manufacturing is going to go away in five years, and you've got this person saying, "We need people to do these jobs right now." That's the challenge of predicting these types of things is that we don't know what demand will look like. I mean, a lot of companies have repatriated, brought their manufacturing back to the US when I don't know that that was necessarily expected right before COVID hit, but a lot of people did that because of the COVID challenges that international supply chains cost. And so, you can look at routine jobs will be diminished, and you will need people to be able to run the technology that does those routine jobs. So those people will need to upskill to be able to run the new machines, to run the new technology.
You look at a simple example like copywriters. When Jasper came out two years ago, copywriters thought they were in trouble, but you've actually seen an increase in a need for copywriters over the last two years, not a decrease, because now there's more content, there's more push for content. And yes, we can use these machines to generate content, but they can't do it alone. They don't know the strategy. They can't edit it. They can't put it in my brand. They can put it in my brand voice, but not the way I want it to be, right?
Carol:
Right. Yeah.
Marie:
[inaudible 00:30:32]. And so, ChatGPT will eliminate the base level of these things. So if you are a base level copywriter, you'll have to upskill to keep your job. If you are a base level resume writer, you'll have to upskill to keep your job. If you're a base level career coach and you're just information giving, you'll have to upskill because that information giving or initial generation of basic text won't be enough. But that doesn't mean those jobs will necessarily be eliminated, we'll just need a higher level of skill to compliment the technology that's coming in.
Carol:
Yeah. I think that goes really well with the concept of the things that are coming out in terms of the need for better communication skills, the need for better social skills, the need to be able to understand each other. I mean, the "soft skills" that people have usually looked upon as nice to haves are really rising as the must-haves, particularly as we're moving forward with so much technology and AI that we're seeing in the workplace.
Marie:
Yeah. And it's got to be coupled with what they call that digital literacy. So you've got digital literacy, emotional intelligence, all of those pieces coming together and creating that model of what do you need to be successful in the future of work. It's going to be both and. You have to have the skills and the ability to use the technology, and then you have to have that emotional intelligence piece as well as the adaptability, some entrepreneurial thinking. Not everybody needs to be an entrepreneur, but you have to have that entrepreneurial thinking of, "What's next? How am I going to adapt? How am I going to be marketable in the next year?" Because that thinking of, "Just put my head down and do my job well," is really going to be troublesome for people.
Carol:
Have you seen any data around leaders, how they're using or leveraging ChatGPT for greater collaboration or team development or really augmenting and stepping up their game in terms of how they're leading? I mean definitely what you just talked about, the flexibility, agility, entrepreneurial mindset, ability to understand digital technology and utilize that are definitely a key, but have you seen other data and information that's saying, "As a leader, if you're going to step into that role, here's what more you need to bring to the table related to AI and even ChatGPT."?
Marie:
That's so interesting. This is something I don't think very many leaders are using it, and it could be a game changer for people. So little micro thing going on in my household because this is what I do, this is what I talk about, and someone in my household started using it in their work and brought it to the company and said, "Hey, have you tried this? It can write product requirements in minutes. It can create a product launch plan. It can identify markets." It was blowing the business people's minds because-
Carol:
Wow,
Marie:
... things they're spending billions of dollars doing, you've got a team out there culling through articles to do a product study, you still want the intelligence, you still want the multiple data points, but now you can boil that down so much faster than you were doing it before. And if there are leaders that aren't using it in their everyday work to create strategy documents, to do research, to understand their market, to even creating the questions that you should ask your customers... You might think, "Oh, it's going to be generic," but if you give it the right prompts, it will actually get pretty specific and even can do some market research for you if you know what to ask. And so, if our business leaders aren't using it, I mean, they could really wow their counterparts, their superiors if they figured out how to bring it in.
There's courses out there for almost every thing, like ChatGPT and product management, how to use ChatGPT and this or that. So I just say go out there and poke around a little bit. Don't need to spend a ton of money, just spend a little bit of money or find some free things and figure out how you might use it in your business, and you might be surprised at what it can do. I mean, I think that it's really made an impact in how this comes across. When you know how to use it, you can demonstrate a use case in your business and show people the time that it could save you.
Carol:
Wow. Wow. That's really impactful to bring it into the workplace as a leader and to really differentiate yourself and even showing that your understanding of utilizing the technology, but also using it in a way that can contribute to the ROI or advance initiatives within the organization I think is pretty powerful. Wow.
Marie:
At a time when everybody's looking to be more efficient and do things faster and you still want to be able to communicate your value alongside it, and that's, I think, where people are afraid, and so they don't use it, but if you can show that you are... I mean, you're the person using the tool, you're going to show how you can use the tool. The tool can't replace you. The tool can't replace you, but someone else who can use the tool might. And so get out there, start playing around with it, start experimenting with how to use it to do your job, and you might be surprised at the ways that it could add value. But it only adds value because you're using it. And so push that fear down and try it and see what it could do. I know people are using it for a lot of non-work things that sounds super fun like planning a menu and planning a trip and searching for flights and some of those-
Carol:
Really? Wow.
Marie:
Yeah, somebody just said that they used it to find a flight, which is amazing. Again, you want to use maybe Bing search to do that. I don't know, I haven't played around with it, but you'd want to use one that's connected to the live internet. But I found that amazing. So you play around with it for some personal things, but then I think that you need to play around with it for some work things, because if you don't know how to use it, you will be outpaced eventually.
Carol:
Yeah, yeah.
Marie:
It's not going anywhere.
Carol:
Yeah. Well, what do you say to people who are afraid of it? I mean, we already talked about, I think, some of the ethical considerations of checking it and not fully relying on it, and definitely making sure that you're bringing yourself into whatever information you're getting, but what do you say to people who are like, "Oh my goodness, I'm afraid of it. It's so big, it's so massive, and I don't know if I want to dig in there."?
Marie:
Just a little bite at a time. Don't put anything into it. You don't need to. There's people, "Oh, don't put confidential information in there." You really don't need to put any information in there. If you want it to help you write your resume, you could put information in, but you don't need to tell it your companies, your dates. You could add all those later. And it's not like it is going to spit out what you put in to someone else, like word for word. That's not how it works. It generates text, so you don't need to be concerned about it putting your statement into someone else's resume. Actually, it's more likely that that's going to happen if you put your stuff online on LinkedIn or whatever. One of our colleagues came up with this, and I love it, don't put anything in ChatGPT that you wouldn't put into LinkedIn. That's a good-
Carol:
Good rule of thumb.
Marie:
Good rule of thumb. But it's a tool. It's not going to take over. Well, maybe it will, but you not using it's not going to prevent that, it's just going to prevent you from growing in your career, right?
Carol:
Exactly.
Marie:
[inaudible 00:39:25] but it's not going to stop it from advancing. It's just going to-
Carol:
Yeah, I love that. Such great advice. It's going to put you behind the eight-ball. I mean, it's clear since the pandemic that technology and AI have been advancing in leaps and bounds, and I'm sure even by the time people listen to this podcast, there'd be something else that have come out that we'll have to learn about.
My goodness, you are a wealth of information and we could probably go on and on about how to use it, but I think we got a really good understanding of it, ways to use it, what to think about with it, some of the other AI platforms that are out there that we can use, which I think it's fantastic. So thank you for that. I just have one question for you before we end our time together, is, when you hear the term Career Rebel, what comes to mind for you?
Marie:
Ooh, I love the word rebel. To me, rebel is not doing what's expected but doing what is innate and authentic to you. I remember getting in trouble when I was young for doing things that were authentic to me. I think maybe all of us can think back to those times that we were told to be quiet or told to do whatever and that were other people's expectations coming on top of and masking our own authentic drive. To me, that rebel, without hurting others or impacting negatively, it's really just listening to and being driven by what's internal and authentic instead of those external expectations.
Carol:
I love that. I would probably also add, if you get into AI and technology, you're being a little bit... utilizing it correctly. If you're afraid, that'd be a little bit of a rebel too. Well, Marie, thank you so much for this time. Is there any place where people can go and learn more from you or from the topic that we talked about today that you would love to share?
Marie:
Yes. I love to talk about the future of work and I train career services providers, so career coaches and resume writers. So if you're looking for a career coach or resume writer, you can go to careerthoughtleaders.com or resumewritingacademy.com and find a professional that's in our network and has taken our trainings. And then also on those sites you'll be able to see the latest that I'm up to. Feel free to plug in, connect, and follow along on LinkedIn. LinkedIn is where I'm probably the most active as well. Love to connect with people on LinkedIn and keep the conversation going.
Carol:
I love that. We will have all of those links in the show notes so that you can easily find those and connect to Marie. I'm sure she would love to chat with you even more about this if you want to drop something, a message in LinkedIn or comment on one of her posts relating to the future of work or ChatGPT or AI. Marie, thank you so much for taking the time out of what I know is a very busy calendar and schedule to share this information with us today. It was so valuable, so needed, and where we're positioned right now and where we're going, it's important that we understand these concepts and know where we're headed so that we can be ahead of the game and not behind it.
Marie:
Yes, thank you so much. Thank you so much, Carol. It's great to be here.
Carol:
Awesome. All right, well, there you have it, Rebels, another amazing episode. There was a lot of information here. And if you are not used to AI or technology, this is going to be one you're going to want to listen to time and time again and play with these tools and get a feel for them and see what's out there and to see how it can help augment wherever you are in your profession or your career or where it may take you next time. So thanks for joining me, and stay tuned for another amazing guest that we'll have to share additional information on the podcast. In the interim, have an amazingly rebellious week, and I'll see you soon.
